Intrada Soundtrack Forum

After seeing the most recent Pirates of the Caribbean movie, I noticed that Klaus Badelt was not credited for the music themes. Hans Zimmer is the credited composer. Then, I found that Badelt had not been credited for the second or third Pirates movies, either, also in favor of Zimmer. What gives?

I understand that Hans Zimmer "overproduced" the first score, and I have read that he has claimed that he wrote the "He's a Pirate" main theme that is credited to Badelt in interviews. Nevertheless, it is Klaus Badelt who is listed as the music composer of the first Pirates movie. Thus, the themes that have followed through the next three movies should all have his name on them. I don't understand how Zimmer somehow usurped the legal credit, or how Walt Disney Records allowed him to do so.

Perhaps I'm naive (and about five years late, I think), but this situation rubs me the wrong way. It reminds me of the never-ending argument regarding the James Bond theme between Monty Norman and John Barry. Whether or not Norman actually wrote the theme, he will always be given credit for it. Then it follows that whether or not Badelt composed the Pirates music, he should be acknowledged in all of the Pirates movies. He's not, and I just don't understand why.

Not a bad question. Badelt was applauded for his work in the first chapter, then dismissed afterwards. But "his" theme stayed. Certainly an oddity.
--Doug

I think both are wonderfully gifted and talented composers - but Zimmer is more of wonderful and talented business man and discoverer of great talent.

I think of Zimmer as a modern day Rodin who was a wonderful sculptor, who also ran a highly-thought-of sculpting studio as a teacher and would often sign his name to the works of his students.

But that is hardly surprising in today's climate of 'credit'. Art directors take credit for designer's work routinely in the deign field. Celebrities take credit for ghost writers work in the publishing field.

But having kept up with Badelt's career - especially his foreign work (Just listen to his wonderful "Love Theme" to "L'Arnacoeur") or his show-stopping "The Time Machine" to know he is a voice to be reckoned with.

_________________
Go ahead, smell my shoe

If my memory is correct, Zimmer could not officially score the film because he was under contract to another studio.

So Badelt gets the credit and uses Zimmer's themes.

According to several interviews with Zimmer, the first Pirates of the Carribbean score is primarily his thematic material. He was working on The Last Samurai for Ed Zwick at the time and had agreed not to work on anything else at the time. When he jumped into this project to help out Jerry Bruckheimer after Alan Silvestri's score was rejected, he wrote all of the themes which then Badelt took and scored to the film.

A shame, really. I was looking forward to a Silvestri swashbuckler.

The consensus seems to be that the first Pirates movie's music was actually written by Hans Zimmer. That's fine; it sure sounds like typical Zimmer music. Yet, it isn't Zimmer who received the legal (public) credit - it was Klaus Badelt. That being said, since Badelt was credited once, why isn't he credited for every remaining time in the series when one of those themes is used? The reason I posed my original question is that I cannot understand how the original composer's name can be so unceremoniously dropped. If the soundtrack has Badelt's name on it (whether or not it was actually written by Zimmer), it should always have Badelt's name on it. Even if Zimmer agreed to defer to Badelt for the film (probably thinking it would be a one-shot deal), how is it that he can then have Badelt's name stripped away for the sequels? Once Zimmer gave up that credit (if indeed he did), it should have been for good. Or, conversely, perhaps Badelt's name should be removed from the first film in favor of Zimmer's, if indeed Badelt was not the actual composer of record. It's a messy situation any way one looks at it.

It just disturbs me that Klaus Badelt is acknowledged as the composer of the first Pirates film and then completely disappears from the others, even though the original music carries on. It's like refusing to credit John Williams for his original themes in the later Superman or Harry Potter movies. Sometimes that acknowledgement is buried deep within the closing credits, such as Jerry Goldsmith's mention for Rambo in 2008, but it is still there. It has to be, or else the creative work of the original composer is rendered insignificant. That cannot be allowed to happen.

No: the themes and maybe some cues were by Zimmer. The scoring was mostly by Badelt. Therefore on the sequels which were scored entirely by Zimmer, there was no need to mention him again. It's not really Indian-giving other than that Badelt gets a little extra credit on the first film. As long as all of the right people were paid, it's not really that big of a deal.

I think flintfan60 is Klaus Badelt himself